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  1. it's all in the balance not in numbers of pets following you, for example you can have one super summon (one example of the build i stated for example) let's say that at end game he hit's 1k or multi summon with 3 pet's that hit 333 each or a fully fleshed necromancer summon as someone asked before with 10 skeletons plus a golem doing 80 damage each skeleton and 200 for the golem for example, in the end they would all be the same overall, so having multiples summons or one summon does not matter as long the balance is done with them not the number of them! this would also influence people and make everyone not taking summoner since What is important in the end is the illusion of freedom and the importance of the gameplay of what makes the player feels good, because this is what the player is in the end doing, playing(at least most of them). If we look at any mmo or mostly rpg games today, ( i will focus only on the dps pve aspect since is simpler to explain with it) we normally have only a illusion of freedom(at least in a good balanced game), if you take any dps class as you role is mainly to dish out damage the develop would create a content and calculate/estimate a overall base damage/stats value for that specific content of the game he created similar as "do X amount in y seconds " simple as that even if you are using a big ass axe, or a sword and shield, or magic or daggers or bows in the end that is what you are needed to do is dish out "x amount of damage in y seconds" and this is the first step of overall balancing: the classes needs to "dish out x amount of damage in y seconds " to pass-advance in this specify content and it does not matter of how you do!. (of course i'm taking the standard scenery here, no one please come saying that you can "keep avoiding" the bosses atk and kills it in 10-20hours, because we know that is not like that, nor the content was not made to be played like that!.) the develops tries to match the classes to this value that is needed by giving us the illusion of freedom and this illusion is given by drawing GOOD POINTS and BAD POINTS of each class and their respective skills!. for example the main factors when considering dps pve aspect!: (again i'm only using dps pve to show a point.overall the number of "Layers" is more complex with as many steps as the develops want it to be ) if the skill damage is dealt by range, it should have a increase or decrease of that base value to reach the base estimate damage needed for the content . if the skill damage is magical, it should have a increase or decrease of that base value to reach the base estimate damage needed for the content . if the skill damage have add on effect, it should increase or decrease the base value to reach the base estimate damage needed for the content . if the class is agility class, it could have less damage but higher frequency of attack to reach the base estimate damage needed for the content . Again i'm only using the dps pve aspect for this, there is more steps and is overall more complex than i showed above but i'm trying to simplify! for example: one of the "layers" i skipped is the "add on effect on skills we have different types of CC like slow, stun and each one would give a up or down in the "overall base estimate damage" needed for the content in the end making it all too big to explain, So why i called "illusion of freedom"? since as i said in the same very example that those classes would have in the end good and bad points that would tilt the balance in favor or not in them doing more damage and the reason is because if the game is IF Balanced enough all those " end values of each class" in the end should be pretty similar to each other so a party of dps should be able to do their role even if you did not use a specific combination of classes, thus the illusion of freedom is formed it does not matter what dps you are picking since they should be able to do their role of dps somehow , of course this is talking about a balanced game something that is hard to come by, and thus creating the "famous METARACE", where one or more classes dps (for this example) is so higher than the other in the base estimate damage for the content that it makes it be better overall than all other choices, something that should not exist!. i'm sure that is even impossible to explain to everyone each step and each "layer" of balancing since the limit is only done by how far the develops wants to go with details in their balancing since even needing to have a specific combination of classes to clear a content is one of the layer of balancing mmo as well(we see this a lot in trinity mmo), some people even call "optimal setup" to clear a content for example, it is also a layer and could be of course add in the mix of balancing but this involves supports and tankers in the mix so i'm gonna skip since i'm trying to keep it to dps only so overall in the end the DPS classes needs to reach a base line of value with all other dps classes with their own different abilities to have a game balanced and this is why "the balance of classes" most of the times never ends in the modern setting of mmo, it is too complex and have too many "LAYERS" but this is not a bad thing too. So going back to summoners, in reality my previous msg seems far delirious in a sense if i could say because what i wrote was more or less bringing all this aspect of "balancing" to the summons as well and not only to the summoner!, so how could they add multiples "Layers" and the illusion of freedom in a summoner and thus making summoners builds balanced with each other? Simple replace the layers i pointed out before for something as i stated in my previous post like : one bigger summon multiple smalls summons summon+summoner using skill Summon fusing with summoner and only summoner using skills in the end all those "DPS summoners" options would have their own downside and upside in the overall "layers" of damage just like differently classes would act with each other and of course all of them should also be in conformism with all others classes and reach a "basic standard for the content not more not less than other classes " and of course you could add support summons, defensive summons, and everything else in the mix as long you have it "balanced" with each other following the same rules for balancing the summoners and his summons as when creating and balancing those support and defensive classes classes for the content. (ps: again i'm only used the dps aspect in this, when you add support skills-defensive skills of course this would tilt the balance in the other way by making it hard for those classes to reach the "basic standard of damage to clear the content", even more in a trinity system game, and this is why people make parties for parties content, by taking a number dps class that have a higher than the "basic standard of damage to clear the content " but "lower base survivability for the content" and mix with it defensive and support classes that have a lower ""basic standard of damage to clear the content" but "higher base survivability for the content" you reach the balance wise situation or in pure dps aspect games, where everyone still needs to have the basic standard dps to clear a content, there is still a lot of other layers to mix things up like mobility, defensive abilities,cc's and so on. )
  2. as i already wrote in a summoner thread about ideas that could bring money when talking about what i would want for the class i reply here as well: selling animation/effects for skills, that a player could buy to personalize his or her gameplay, (of course timing iframes of said skills should all be the same), but let's say colors>movements could be changed, this is the biggest cosmetic market for a free to play mmo in my opinion, since diversity not only would bring money but also appeal for each player, since everyone likes to be different and likes to be unique so with a bigger gamma of animations-colors-effects that you could buy-change on your skills to mix things up and in the end have a extra IN-DEEP personalize option for everyone. SKINS; i know that the game gonna have different types of skins but what i'm talking here is to really put the system to use and not make the same mistake most games does that is does not think outside the box: they take a staff weapon and creates multiples "staffs" skins, but does not explore and mix things up like allowing a staff use to use a wand skin, or a magic gloves skin, since sometimes a player likes to be a wizard but does not like to have a big ass staff in your screen, sometimes you want to be minimalist and why not? A dagger user could use a two sword skins a sword+dagger a sword+short sword skins, in the trailer we had a class using a two handed AXE, why not have skills for axe but also broadswords and the list goes on, i believe everyone understand what i'm getting at, because let's remember if the game wants to be free to pay, it needs to have VOLUME in the shop.
  3. i hope they can go with something like that but hey is not the end of the world if they keep the main staff as well since creating a new weapon branch would be a hell of work but them they could go and do something like what i'm gonna write below: i have been playing mmo for years now, going close to 20, and i really felt that todays game, most of them says no p2w and things like that but in the end goes back on their word because cosmetic alone does not sell enough and i felt that this is just because they have not gone in deep enough with it. for example what i talked before about book-hands summoning: hell they can go staff main weapon for summoner too; but why not make a SKIN with different weapon like the book summoning and magical gloves skins? and sell them, lot of people would buy!. i know some would say about animation and so much more, but why not take this as opportunity? like make for example a simple animation for a gloves summon SKIN all of them, really simple, but sell special animation for skills separately as well, and this i does not mean just for one weapon!, but for all of them, people would buy without doubt just think the last mmorpg you played, and remember the MAIN SKILL you use, how cool would be if there was different types of animations/colors for that skill? so everyone can have their own match they like and would be a boom, even more because no one would ever buy "only" one SKIN, players would buy even if they just changed the color of the skill, just because why not? is different and people like to be different than the others. for example the rogue, as we have seen the preview rogues uses dual dagger, but how cool would be if there was a katana style WEAPON SKIN or dual claw style gloves (wow shaman style claw style weapons) that you can buy, even more since you would be able to buy new special animations for them and the old "standard" dual daggers skills too. and yeah this would cost money in animation but is not the same money that must be spend in other places to make a game viable, even more since as said they could put weapon with standard simple animation "only" and also sell animation all separately for each special skill and so on!, would be EPIC.
  4. just gonna write things i would like to have in the summoner class and mention all things that all other games makes it wrong in my opinion! 1: does not use a normal staff-wand since would be pretty standard/cliche where all magic classes uses both of those weapons!. you guys can go with Book style summoning weapon, or a handcrafted magic gloves jewel/orb for a more minimalist detail example of magic gloves style weapon : 2: being able to handle more than one summon at the same time(as full time summon), (since again other cliche in all summon types games only allows for one summon at the same time), so we can COMBO summons and skills making all the gameplay more complex! and of course both summons should affects each other in their interactions of skills/buffs and also the player can not have all the "types" because of talents-skill points and so on. EXAMPLE: two "normal" summons that we can ALSO sacrifice for a time limited ultimate summon for players that likes to play with summon + using base skill/magic of the class itself! thus having diversity multiple and builds as well going in advancement for example of: 2.1:full summoner that have mainly talents and skills focused on two or more summons at the same time! 2.2: or a summoner who likes to use-sacrifice his summons for a super BUFF and uses his OWN magic skills or play with ultimate summon+ his own magic skills at the same time! 3: (i know i already said this before but is good to mention again) As advancement class we could go multiples paths where one focus on the base two summons (always maintaining two summons) and the other allows for a ultimate summon+magic skills from the caster path for players that want that type of "wizard + pet gameplay because sometimes you just want a summon but also to kickass yourself so a sacrificing type summoner x buff is a good option ) of course if the games have more than two advancement paths, we can always go for a complete ultimate summon type; a multiple summon path; full sacrifice summon for selfbuff and use his own skills path; and why not a fully healing type summons path as well, since only have cleric as healing is boring!. each path have his own DIFFERENT GAMEPLAY STYLE but all of them in the SUMMONING LORE and would be a blast to play without doubt.
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